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Mathmatical Proof Of Advanced Civilizati...

How many advanced civilizations capable of radio astronomy where there, are there, could there someday be in the Milky Way galaxy? Dr. Carl Sagan ventures a guess.

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15 Comments

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Chuckus : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Chuckus

Hidden (Show Comment) -85 votes

68 days 21 hours ago...

Wow algebra teaching morality. Somewhere an atheists head exploded.

The Living End : LVL 60: VP 5: said:

The Living End

28 votes NegativePositive

68 days 19 hours ago...

^ You apparently weren`t watching this clip at all. He mentioned nothing of morality.

Moving along.

I love Carl Sagan. He had such a way of explaining things that almost made astrophysics, astronomy, and the like easy to comprehend. He is missed.

blue_devil : LVL 42: VP 5: said:

blue_devil

22 votes NegativePositive

68 days 13 hours ago...

the calculus was for only 1 galaxy
"The Hubble Space Telescope has found there may be 125 billion galaxies in the universe."
i guess we can safely say that we are not alone in the universe.
did the big bang happen only once in all the infinity of nothingness to create only our universe? what is outside it ? are there other universes ?

what we know today is just a drop in a sea of knowledge

GameWarrior2216 : LVL 24: VP 3.3: said:

GameWarrior2216

5 votes NegativePositive

68 days 10 hours ago...

The question isn`t "Is there other life/civilizations in the galaxy" but rather how to get there or interact with them. I`m sure one day we`ll find life on another world but still find ourselves alone in the universe.

Tada : LVL 45: VP 5: said:

Tada

33 votes NegativePositive

68 days 10 hours ago...

This isn`t a mathematical proof. For example if his numbers are wrong it could mean that there might be either a million or just two out there. The equation is based on assumptions, not known facts so it`s not a proof of any kind.

exhaustedmule : LVL 28: VP 3.7: said:

exhaustedmule

Hidden (Show Comment) -14 votes

68 days 8 hours ago...

Its theory, not assumption.


big difference.

Omeko : LVL 40: VP 4.8: said:

Omeko

Hidden (Show Comment) -18 votes

68 days 4 hours ago...

The big question is....
Will any one give me a handjob?

minusslade : LVL 28: VP 3.7: said:

minusslade

2 votes NegativePositive

68 days 3 hours ago...

To me there is not doubt that there are other lifeforms, Intelligent or not. However will we ever make contact with one, not likely. Based on the fact that current travel would take centuries to go anywhere within our galaxy, and even our deep space communication abilities are also lacking, and searching is another very "needle in a galactic haystack" scenario. If we are to ever communicate with another life form, they would have to be doing the brunt of the traveling/talking, because we simply do not have the resources or technology. It would be amazing if more people/companies actually cared enough to actually fund and research more into interstellar space travel but alas the common person cares nothing for the stars.
And though technically it isn`t proof, it`s just a simple way for scientists to gain some semblance of the odds stacked against making first contact.

Tada : LVL 45: VP 5: said:

Tada

6 votes NegativePositive

68 days 3 hours ago...

exhaustedmule: The equation as a whole is theoretical, however the values of the factors in it can only be assumed at this point.

In fact, as a tool for predicting the number of civilization it`s completely useless. The only way we can know that we are using the right numbers is if we found a most of the civilizations and planets with life out there just like we`ve found most stars. Basically it`ll a like making an equation which says "I`ll know how many people there are in the room once I`ve counted them all."

Chuckus : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Chuckus

-2 votes NegativePositive

67 days 22 hours ago...

The Living End:

If you missed carl sagan`s point then you have no ability to analyze beyond superficial explanation.

The point is that cooperation and seeking to be a non war like self destructive race has dramatic mathematical consequences that favor positively for the universe. By simply altering a variable by a slight percent dramatically increases the chance of intelligent life thriving in the universe, while letting our petty differences consume us almost erradicate all life or reduce it to almost nothing.

That`s a very interesting philisophical proposition.

Grothesk : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Grothesk

6 votes NegativePositive

67 days 13 hours ago...

This is the cutting edge of thinking....from the 80`s.

Phi : LVL 35: VP 4.3: said:

Phi

Hidden (Show Comment) -10 votes

67 days 13 hours ago...

`Let`s assume my house is big, say, 100 feet by 100 feet. Now, if we examine this 10x10 portion of it that I`m in, we see we have one person in it. So, if we assume that every part of this house is filled the same way as this room, there are 100 people in this house. Now, just to be safe, we might be a bit more conservative. We know that some of those other rooms are fit for life; some have food, others have chairs and beds and things. But let`s say this room is optimal, and on average, those others are just half optimal. That means there are 50 people in this house.`

There. I have `proved` that there are at least 50 people in this house.

I really dislike listening to Carl Sagan. His enunciation, and his arguments/attempts at explanation feel extremely patronizing.

LeighCedar : LVL 40: VP 4.8: said:

LeighCedar

4 votes NegativePositive

67 days 9 hours ago...

Alright Chuckus.... I follow your "morality in the formula" argument....what does that have to do with exploding an atheist`s head?

This is a man made formula.

SolarAbyss : LVL 42: VP 5: said:

SolarAbyss

-1 votes NegativePositive

67 days 5 hours ago...

Yeah, problem with his math is they have only found a few planets outside of our system that are even remotely habitable, most are gas giants. So 0.25 planets per system would be a very poor estimate

SantaAndFriends : LVL 39: VP 4.7: said:

SantaAndFriends

6 votes NegativePositive

67 days 4 hours ago...

Yeah we`ve only found a few planets beyond our own solar system because they are near impossible to find, they don`t reflect enough light of their surfaces to be detected by our own instruments, so the only way we know if planets are there is if star follows a distinctive wobble pattern that would indicate there are other solar masses influencing it I don`t even think we`ve located over 1000 planets outside of our own, and yet there are billions out there, so let`s not jump to hasty conclusions Solar...


I like what he said "But then civilizations make billions of years of tortuous years of evolution only to snuff themselves out in an instant of unforgivable neglect"

Makes you realize how stupid we really are caring so much about money, religion, politics, race, gender, all these things especially how priveleged we are to be here, it`s almost as if we were chosen to be here with this immense power. And yet we turn our backs and use it to kill, develop new technology in the name of killing and hatred

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