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Astronomer Guy Consolmagno Speaking on R...

Guy Consolmagno, MIT astronomer, Jesuit brother at the Vatican Observatory, and recent chair of the Division for Planetary Sciences of the American Astronomical Society, discusses a wide range of subjects dealing with the intersection of science and religion, including Galileo. He takes some questions towards the end, including one on Galileo. A bit long but worth watching. This Guy is brilliant.

  • Csmack
  • posted by Csmack
  • Date 6/16/2009 7:18:14 PM
  • Views: 2070
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15 Comments

Current View: 15 / Show all Comments

Sir spanks-a-lot : LVL 40: VP 4.8: said:

Sir spanks-a-lot

2 votes NegativePositive

158 days 19 hours ago...

the host is wrong...


all religion is junk religion

you can argue all you want for religion, but it`s the same as arguing for a monkey in silk dress... it`s still a monkey.

as soon as a religion comes into view in a scientific argument, the argument itself is invalid.

these guys might be quirky, but the fact that they wear religious clothing and that they represent a religious entity immediately disqualifies them from participating in a scientific discussion.

this guy might be smart, but his purposes are completely misdirected.

i`m calling bullshit on them.

they don`t belong in spikedhumor.

Sir spanks-a-lot : LVL 40: VP 4.8: said:

Sir spanks-a-lot

1 votes NegativePositive

158 days 19 hours ago...

... and i`ve had chocolate after i drank wine...

nothing wrong with it...

Tajumera : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Tajumera

3 votes NegativePositive

158 days 17 hours ago...

^ Humans are classed as mammals, then great apes, not monkeys. Nobody cares if you believe in evolution or not, it is verified by evidence without the need for your whimsical and turbulent "faith".

Anyway,
Science: We need to remove personal bias, and come up with testable, reproducible models for natural phenomena.

Religion: This is true, because we say so, our only source of "evidence" is this book which contradicts itself, and our current understanding of the universe, frequently.

It doesn`t matter whether or not the Catholic church has historically opposed science. By definition, religion and science are opposed. Religion requires blind faith, whereas science aims to eliminate it completely.

Scientists can be religious, but in the same way that they can be musicians, or racists, or stamp enthusiasts... people can`t usually be defined by one idea, interest or principle, and they can even live with contradiction. Good people can be sometimes bad, rationalists can be irrational and homophobes can swing both ways.

Csmack : LVL 36: VP 4.4: said:

Csmack

-3 votes NegativePositive

158 days 17 hours ago...

Sir spanks-a-lot "the fact that they wear religious clothing and that they represent a religious entity immediately disqualifies them from participating in a scientific discussion."
- That`s incredibly ignorant. You seem quite discriminatory when it comes to science. This is a point I heard Guy Consolmagno make when he came to Cornell University to give a lecture; many atheists aren`t true advocates of science b/c they don`t want religious people participating in science. Science, however, should be open to everyone.

Obviously the American Astronomical Society`s Division for Planetary Sciences (the same society Carl Sagan was a member of) thought he had something worthwhile to contribute. Are you completely unaware of history`s greatest scientists who also were affiliated with religion (many times Christianity) contributed significantly to science? Should Gregor Mendel have been excluded from science b/c he was a brother too? Science wouldn`t be as advanced as it is today if it wasn`t for the contributions of all these religious scientists.

Very ignorant of you. I`m calling bullshit on you b/c you`re no advocate of science.

Csmack : LVL 36: VP 4.4: said:

Csmack

-3 votes NegativePositive

158 days 16 hours ago...

Tajumera "By definition, religion and science are opposed... Scientists can be religious, but in the same way that they can be musicians"
- These 2 points are contradictory. If a scientist being religious is like a scientist being a musician, and being both a scientist and musician poses no conflict, why does being religious and a scientist pose a conflict? Many of history`s greatest scientists who were religious felt no opposition. Were they not true scientists? Wouldn`t they know? Besides, the questions religion seeks to answer are out of the scope of science. Science concerns itself with the physical while religion concerns itself with the spiritual.

"It doesn`t matter whether or not the Catholic church has historically opposed science."
- Remind your fellow atheists on this site that it doesn`t matter next time they spout their talking points on the Church being anti science.

Tajumera : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Tajumera

-1 votes NegativePositive

158 days 16 hours ago...

The musician/racist/stamp enthusiast part was to show that people have many aspects to their lives, i gave examples of contradictions afterwords... Religion is a different part of their lives, the application is different, but at the same time, it is irrational where science is rational. In that sense, they are opposed but the oppostion may not come into play in daily life.

Spirituality is completely unquantifiable, and therefore subjective, where science is purely objective by definition. There is no spiritual world that we know of, so you may as well be talking about your dreams when you get "spiritual"

"Remind your fellow atheists on this site that it doesn`t matter next time they spout their talking points on the Church being anti science." - Well, it might not be relevant to my point, but the validity of their arguments is variable, it might be relevant to them. I just don`t think its necessary when pointing out the opposition of science and religion.

Csmack : LVL 36: VP 4.4: said:

Csmack

-3 votes NegativePositive

158 days 15 hours ago...

^ I didn`t really see any strong examples of contradictions unless the line "true, because we say so, our only source of "evidence" is this book which contradicts itself" was an example. You said religion requires faith and science doesn`t but even science operates under the assumption that the universe is orderly and rational, one that can be understood through laws. Dr.Consolmagno also mentioned that point in his lecture. Wouldn`t so many rational scientists (much smarter than either of us) who lived religious lives have been able to spot something irrational? Are you claiming to be a clearer thinker than them?

"the oppostion may not come into play in daily life."
- Then when does it come into play?

Tajumera : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

Tajumera

1 votes NegativePositive

158 days 6 hours ago...

I said that good people can do bad things, rationalists can be irrational and homophobes can be bi or gay... people often live with contradiction.

I doubt that most of the historically religious scientists would be religious if they lived in our time, given the overwhelming number of atheists/agnostics in the scientific community. Obviously there will always be exceptions... but they are still the exception, not the rule.

The opposition comes into play when the religious part of a persons life creeps into the scientific.... like when people try to ban the teaching of science and replace it with religion. I`m just saying that there is an opposition. It can be managed and avoided, that doesn`t mean it`s not there.

watchingu : LVL 37: VP 4.5: said:

watchingu

3 votes NegativePositive

153 days 21 hours ago...

Religion is a man made crutch useful for dealing with knowledge of our own mortality... always has been, always will be.

ratbag1410 : LVL 32: VP 4.1: said:

ratbag1410

2 votes NegativePositive

150 days 17 hours ago...

Put up straw men and knock them down.
For an educated man this astrologer is a fool.

Reggycide : LVL 1: VP 1: said:

Reggycide

-3 votes NegativePositive

150 days 5 hours ago...

I BELIEVE THAT A STORY PASSED DOWN BY A LOT OF PEOPLE FOR THOOUUSSAAANDDSSS OF YEARS IS MORE TRUE THAN ANY STORY TOLD BY SCIENTISTS FOR HUNDREDS OF YEARS.

ratbag1410 : LVL 32: VP 4.1: said:

ratbag1410

2 votes NegativePositive

149 days 18 hours ago...

Csmak "If a scientist being religious is like a scientist being a musician, and being both a scientist and musician poses no conflict, why does being religious and a scientist pose a conflict? Many of history`s greatest scientists who were religious felt no opposition. Were they not true scientists? Wouldn`t they know? Besides, the questions religion seeks to answer are out of the scope of science. Science concerns itself with the physical while religion concerns itself with the spiritual.

"It doesn`t matter whether or not the Catholic church has historically opposed science."
- Remind your fellow atheists on this site that it doesn`t matter next time they spout their talking points on the Church being anti science."

I think you lost the plot here Csmack

Lie down take 20 deep breaths and STFU

thinkbolt : LVL 35: VP 4.3: said:

thinkbolt

2 votes NegativePositive

146 days 17 hours ago...

This "astronomer" started getting his facts wrong as soon as he started talking.

Csmack : LVL 36: VP 4.4: said:

Csmack

-2 votes NegativePositive

146 days 14 hours ago...

^ I find it funny you try to question his credentials as an astronomer while you would have a hard time finding a more educated one than him. He was the chair of the very organization Carl Sagan was a member of. Would this imply Carl Sagan was not a real astronomer? Thinkbolt, you obviously came to ur conclusion before watching the video so any wisdom he did have to say unfortunately fell on deaf ears, but what exactly disqualifies him as an astronomer?

And ratbag, he`s an astronomer, not an astrologer, read the description. He`s MIT degree in astronomy speaks for itself. Where did you go to college if at all?

Very narrow minded of both of you.

ratbag1410 : LVL 32: VP 4.1: said:

ratbag1410

3 votes NegativePositive

145 days 21 hours ago...

^ Csmack quite right to question where I went to college, I did not! I completed my studies at universities.

Could I trouble you for an account of your "education"

To disqualify this moron as a scientist is easy:
If you believe in God and that the Bible is the Word of God you believe the universe is 6 to 7 thousand years old. QED

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